2007 Farm Bill: More Corporate Welfare

Submitted by Saij on Mon, 2007-10-29 11:01.

(cross-posted at Goodtithings.com

We're fat.  Americans are the fattest people on the planet, bar none.  We (as a people) don't exercise, and we eat like shit.  And part of the reason for that is that we have a corporate welfare system that extends to those large commercial farmers that produce products that are horrible for our health like corn, white rice, and sugar, driving down the price of those products while causing the prices of vegetables to rise. 

But, it isn't just our physical health that suffers, it's our economic health.  Those small and organic farmers that may in fact need the help, don't get it.  And those farmers from 3rd world countries that are still farming by hand, are pushed into poverty because they can't compete with the bohemeth tractor-farms in the US who are getting billions of dollars a year in government handouts, causing massive poverty and death.

On the bright side, the new Farm Bill does provide some money for conservation, but it amounts to little more than 10% of the funding.  I'd suggest we double or triple that amount for conservation efforts and then cut the rest of the subsidies to zero.  We'd save money, allow for the free market to do it's thing, have cheaper healthy food, and drive the price of crap-food up a bit to reflect not only it's natural market price but also it's negative effect on the human body. 

I thought republicans didn't like welfare?

Good Points

#5001 On Mon, 2007 10 29 15:35 FreedomDemocrats said,

Going after our perverse agribusiness welfare system is something that everyone, conservatives, liberals, and libertarians, should support.

I agree, a healthy diet is much more expensive than

#5003 On Tue, 2007 10 30 02:18 ka1igu1a said,

an unhealthy one, that's for sure.

is it so hard to eat well?

#5004 On Tue, 2007 10 30 06:36 adam ricketson said,

I acknowledge that there is plenty of really cheap junk "food" out there, there is also plenty of healthful food out there that is cheaper than common low-quality foods. Even soda pop is more expensive than water (fill a bottle from your tap).

To continue with that theme, any prepared food is relatively expensive, and relatively unhealthy. If you want a high fiber, high protein, low-fat, low-sugar meal...then cook some rice and beans. Stick some spices in there, and maybe some cheese. It ain't that bad. Fresh produce is rather expensive, but you can get good deals on frozen/canned vegetables. 

 I don't think that the problem is that good food is expensive...it's that bad food is accessible and so tasty.

Overall, Cheaper to eat Fat

#5007 On Tue, 2007 10 30 09:57 FreedomDemocrats said,

Multiple studies have shown that if you're eating on the cheap, your diet is going to suck. The price of fruit and vegetables has gone up signficantly over the last few decades, while the price of candy and soda continues to fall.

two issues

#5010 On Tue, 2007 10 30 21:26 adam ricketson said,

There are two issues here, and to make sure we aren't talking past each other, I want to be explicity about them:

  1. Bias in food choice: I agree that cheaper junk food will result in greater consumption of junk food. This applies to anyone who is at all price sensitive, and probably applies more to the poor than to the middle class.
  2. Necessary constraint on food choice: I disagree that our food markets are structured such that a person has to rely on "junk food" to get by. I agree that fresh produce is inaccessible to the poor, but that does not leave them to only eat sugary and fatty foods. In my market, complex carbs and lean (vegetable) proteins are no more expensive that simple carbs and fatty proteins. I don't think that poverty would force a person to eat junk food just based on the prices of the commodities. If poverty is going to necessarily disrupt a person's nutrition, it will be through lack of access to:
    1. fresh produce (as stated before)
    2. a kitchen
    3. a grocery store
    4. nutritional knowledge
    5. time to prepare food

Second Point

#5018 On Wed, 2007 10 31 09:56 FreedomDemocrats said,

Focusing on your second point.

We agree on the limitations on fresh produce, kitchens, grocery stores, nutritional knowledge, and time to prepare food. All of which will cause problems for the diet of those in poverty.

I would argue that the net effect of all this is to make junk foods cheaper than healthy foods. I'd also add food insecurity, which will impact metabolism.

But when you subsidize corn to the point that HFC syrup based soda is cheaper than water, or your cheapest meal is a McDonald's burger, there's going to have an impact.

Rice, beans, and tap water

#5005 On Tue, 2007 10 30 07:04 ka1igu1a said,

well, ok, you got me there...

I never said it was fun to be poor...

#5009 On Tue, 2007 10 30 21:17 adam ricketson said,

...just that being poor doesn't mandate that a person eat junk food (as was implied by the comment that junk food is cheaper than non-junk food).

If poverty is going to constrain a person's access to food, it will be due to lack of:

  1. Fresh produce
  2. A functioning kitchen
  3. A local grocery store
 Based on the prices in my local grocery store, fats and simple sugars are not a less expensive source of calories than complex carbohydrates. Likewise, fatty protein is not less expensive than lean (vegetable) protein.

You're missing the point...

#5017 On Wed, 2007 10 31 08:50 ka1igu1a said,

I shop at either Harris Teeter or Whole Foods, which caters more to my preference for healthy foods, but is much more expensive than the likes of, say, Food Lion, which offers cheaper prices but doesn't even come close to offering the healthy food alternatives that I expect as a shopper. Your making the point that the dedicated but poorer shooper can find what he needs at the likes of, say, a Food Lion, and I don't dispute that, but good luck in any Food Lion shopper maintaining such dedication to a healthy lifestyle by shopping at Food Lion. It just isn't happening...